Mimicing the 360 ROL...

[jrfhoutx]

OK, I know that the ROL mimic has been done, I've seen the way it was done previously over at that other site, and I want to expand upon what's already been done. this is part of a new personal project I've started. I have a ROL shaped window in my 360 and I want to mimic the ROL in the window during startup and controller synching, but after initial start-up sequence or Sync sequence I want the window mimic to display the 3rlod instead of the active synched controllers...

I've talked to a few people previously a little about this and possibly using a pic somewhere in the equation, but I'm stuck on getting the effect I want after start-up and sync...

If my explanation is lacking or unclear let me know where I've lost you and I'll do my best to get my point across...

More on the ROL:

How the Ring Of Light Works






I would like to do this old skool (ie. no PICs) but my progress on this is slow so I will open this up to everyone for discussion...

any ideas?

[FOOKz™]

OK Transistors work by controlling the Current of a circuit. MOSFETS work by controlling the voltage of a circuit. In the Diagram there are Several transistors acting like a switch and a variable resistor because there is a fade light effect.

You Need to know Basic Transistor Function:

Transistors Need 0.6 to 0.7 Volts on the Base to control current through the Collector and Emitter.

Transistors have an Operating Point or Q point, you don't need to know about the Q point if your designing a switching operation, but you will need to know if your designing a fader circuit.

The Q point is the quiescent point; its the Exact Middle of Your Vce and Ie at a 90⁰ Angle.

Your Vce is Saturation
Your Ie is Cutoff
(its a bunch of Nerd Math and i don't feel like typing it all here so yea)

Basically Right to the point is that there are Biasing Resistors across the supply and the base of the transistors that feed the base of the transistors some voltage that turns on the transistor on, but not completely on. The transistor Has not hit saturation yet, but its not cutoff. The LEDs will be dim.

Heres a Simplified diagram and a Q Point Drawing:

[jrfhoutx]

actually I'm not wondering why they stay dimly lit, cause they don't... I want to have the LEDs in my case mimic the LEDs on the 360 ROL for the start up function and sync functions and then switch to mimic a 3RROD...

[FOOKz™]

actually I'm not wondering why they stay dimly lit, cause they don't... I want to have the LEDs in my case mimic the LEDs on the 360 ROL for the start up function and sync functions and then switch to mimic a 3RROD...

You want a circuit EXACTLY like The Xbox360's Lights EXACTLY the Way it Flashes and You want it to have Red Ring of Death?

One more Question. Do you Want to Hook it up to something other than your 360 or do you just want to run a circuit off of the SMD lights already installed in the faceplate? Ether Way it can be done. The dude that Made the Circuit diagram isn't totally a dumba$$ but hes missing the point of a transistor, hes using them to switch voltage; a big mistake. Transistors are used to control Current. Mosfets are Used to control Voltage at Variable current levels.

I RECOMMEND a Component to replace all of the transistors with an IC called an Analog Switch. The Analog Switch uses Two Mosfet transistors in paralell to accept an incoming signal at two different polarities at different times. Look for a Part Called a 4066B. This is basically what the chip is Designed for. The 4066 can replace 4 switching transistors.

If you want this to be on your controller then we have work cut out for us.

[jrfhoutx]

You want a circuit EXACTLY like The Xbox360's Lights EXACTLY the Way it Flashes and You want it to have Red Ring of Death?

One more Question. Do you Want to Hook it up to something other than your 360 or do you just want to run a circuit off of the SMD lights already installed in the faceplate?

yes, this will be in the 360 not on a controller or anything else. it will be for lighting a window cut into the 360 case. so what I want it to do is when I start up the 360 or sync a controller the window lighting will come on and mimic the 360 start-up and sync sequences and then after the start-up/sync mimic automatically switch and display RROD, and if I sync a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th controller I want the RROD to switch off and display the sync sequence and then switch back to the RROD...

I will be using ~16 3mm LEDs to light the window

just to clarify my OP: of the two schematics from my OP, the first one is the actual ROL schematic, the second one is the same schematic with a ROL mimic added...

edit:
will the 4066B control a PWM signal? or does the PWM not matter?

[FOOKz™]

edit:
will the 4066B control a PWM signal? or does the PWM not matter?

It Doesn't matter. Be sure to check the Minimum and Maximum Signal I/O Operating Voltages. The 4066 May not respond to tiny voltages under 0.2V and if the voltage is over 18Volts in then the signal will be chopped off and distorted. There Also is a Max Frequency it can operate but thats pretty high, i doubt we'll need to reach anything close to 500MHz.

Basically the 4066 is ether a Short or an Open almost zero resistance when switched on and almost infinite resistance when off. The Signal will not be amplified or modulated (unless the signal is High Freq. and or High Voltage)

Whats the voltage/current ratings for your LEDs

[PspKicks316]

May I interrupt here...

Could you not just replicate the circuit used on the RoL and wire it to the same MS IC pins as the circuit through a transistor array, and then just have a timer IC of some sort toggle the switching transistors off once the bootup sequence is done so that you're then controlling the makeshift RoL how you want it?

You could then have something set so that if the sync button is held down to a certain amount of time (until it starts syncing) and then the IC flips on the transistor array again, connecting your RoL to the original RoL, mimicking the sync chasing now?

That could surely be done with a simple 8 pin PIC.

I didn't read the rest of the thread, so excuse me if I reposted an idea.

Edit:
Just read that you didn't want to use PICs.
Well, what about ICs?
You could use a timer IC to toggle the transistor array when after a certain amount of time from startup (receiving power from the 360), and an interrupt IC that will toggle the transistors when the sync button is pressed.

[FOOKz™]

im not saying it can't be done but sure you can do it with an 8-pin-pic to run code for the LED sync function then that will run the 4066 to drive the 16 LEDs and 555 Timer (if thats what your saying) then that is pretty damned easy.

If i did not clearly re state your answer then plz draw a schematic; else idk.

BTW:

I didn't read the rest of the thread, so excuse me if I reposted an idea.

You Didn't give me your LED's Specs LoL

[PspKicks316]

BTW:  You Didn't give me your LED's Specs LoL

That would be Jr you want for that, not me. I was just giving a thought I had on it.

[FOOKz™]

That would be Jr you want for that, not me. I was just giving a thought I had on it.

Ok, then lets say you are using Common 3mm Red 2.4v at 20mA Leds with a 100 ohm resistor in series. The supply is 12 volts.

Anyway this is what R&D is for we just need to wait and see who will make this thing first you, me or someone really rich wiff alotz of spendin' monies.

[jrfhoutx]

OK, I understand the concept of using the 4066B to replace things, but to clarify how this component would be wired into the diagram that you made above...



would it be:
Pin1  - R1
Pin2  - Modded LED1
Pin3  - R2
Pin4  - Modded LED2
Pin5  - 360 LED2
Pin6  - 360 LED3
Pin7  - Ground
Pin8  - R3
Pin9  - Modded LED3
Pin10 - R4
Pin11 - Modded LED4
Pin12 - 360 LED4
Pin13 - 360 LED1
Pin14 - +5V (+3.3V)

Am I interpreting that correctly? now if so, I can see how this would give the Mimic effect, but how would I use this to give me the RROD effect that I'm looking for? Am I missing something here or would I need to add a component to get this effect?

Spent some time making up this diagram to go with the above pinout...

[FOOKz™]

ok man i think your having a bit of trouble understanding or i might just not be explaining it right idk. so here's a quick Block diagram of whats supposed to be achieved.

Later i will post up a Full schematic of how to do the fader. i just need to know your duty cycle you want(how long it fades) and the up time(how long you want the LEDs on full power) and the down time(how long you want them to be off).

I will design a circuit without using Expensive PICs cuz i don't have one(never used one)... im not kidding.

[jrfhoutx]

idk where the confusion is, but I simply made up my diagram based on this diagram that you posted earlier



according to that diagram my diagram and pinout is exactly what you posted... unless I have pins 1,2,3,4,8,9,10,11 backwards ie. pins 1&2 swapped, 3&4 swapped, 8&9 swapped, and 10&11 swapped... unless you mean my power and ground should be swapped...

and I think I understand how the 4066B will mimic but I don't understand how it will mimic and then switch to a RROD after mimicing...

i just need to know your duty cycle you want(how long it fades) and the up time(how long you want the LEDs on full power) and the down time(how long you want them to be off).

I want an exact mimic of the ROL while it's starting up and/or syncing and then switch to RROD when those complete. I want the RROD effect to be lit all the time otherwise...

I will design a circuit

if you could please use the same base diagram I'm using that would go a long way to helping me understand where my errors are...

[FOOKz™]

im working on a circuit that will Run the 4066 on start up then a few logic gates will control the 4066(es) (Plural 4066) to switch reciprocally.

One of the analog switches(4066) will control green and the other will control red. When a Capacitor discharges from a one shot multivibrator it will trigger a flip flop to stay on Until the power is turned off.(reset)

The Flip flop then will reverse the order of which 4066(es) will be on, thus changing green to red digitally without rendering the fade effect useless.

im estimating $12 (7pounds/euro) of parts to buy. Thats a hell of alot cheaper than using a PIC! right?

You Will understand why the diagram you drew was wrong, i forgot to mention something thats why its wrong; my fault plz forgive me. the blue wire that controls the 4066 is supposed to be on the anode... it has something to do with that fact the 360 uses common anode or(TTL) logic.

EDIT: im going to breadboard this tonight to be sure it will work.

[jrfhoutx]

i forgot to mention something thats why its wrong; my fault plz forgive me.

no problem, lol. I knew I wrote it up exactly as I read it off the diagram...

im working on a circuit that will Run the 4066 on start up then a few logic gates will control the 4066(es) (Plural 4066) to switch reciprocally.

One of the analog switches(4066) will control green and the other will control red. When a Capacitor discharges from a one shot multivibrator it will trigger a flip flop to stay on Until the power is turned off.(reset)

The Flip flop then will reverse the order of which 4066(es) will be on, thus changing green to red digitally without rendering the fade effect useless.

OK, sounds a bit complex, but I think I follow...

EDIT: im going to breadboard this tonight to be sure it will work.

cool, can't wait to see what the results are...

I'm out for the night, check back in tomorrow...

[theyarealltaken]

Did you guys ever get anywhere with this? Another topic was started in the 360 section, trying to achieve the same result (well everything but the RROD error at the end of the sequence). Did you ever get this breadboarded up?
Another user and myself would really appretiate any help yopu could give us to get a solution to this, its doing our heads in.

[jrfhoutx]

no this method and the diagrams are flawed and I don't personally have time to find the errors or to continue work on the project, wysiwyg.