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=> Discussion Boards => General Discussion => Topic started by: ccccpie on January 02, 2008, 01:02:02 AM
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To me the term "gangster" is more of an insult now.
I mean the original "gangsters" were smart men who just lived an impoverished life making them "tough".These good men made money exploiting the needs of the people, but not ruin the people they make money from.Case and point way back when, "Mafiosi" as the Italian mafia people were called didn't sell drugs. They became the government when there wasn't one.They were respected for what they did to help and also feared for what they can do.There were some like this like many of the Mexican gangs in L.A., they started out as block gangs protecting their neighborhood from dope dealers and other people who would hurt their neighborhood.
The new "gangsters" are typically men many of which are minorities and live on impoverished sections.Living in such a condition they found drugs. And some of these "smart" guys saw the profit and made their money through drug dealing.Many "gangsters" of today are just foot soldiers, if you think about it they ain't worth :censored: compared to guys back then (Unless you're a norteno ).
In short, gangsters back then( and some of recent like the men from Harlem ) was for sophisticated men who exploited in a way that doesn't hurt a lot of their business.Gangsters now are money and power hungry people that are disillusioned that the way to glory is through murder and dope dealing.They kill for fun,they don't (most) think about what they are doing and most aren't smart.
Discuss.
Don't move this to Spam section this is intelligent conversation.
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yea i agree with u
but its mobster aswell
but old mobsters didnt kill inocent ppl
they killed their target
which reminds me
my grandparents have a gun from jessie james
he gave it to them as a gift because they let him stay at their homes barn while the cops where lookin for him(aswell as other mobsters)
so he gave them his gun as a token of appreciation and gratitude
and that the fact taht if they where cought they could be killed too(and they had nothing to protect themselfs with)
moral is that i bet today that modern day gansters wouldnt do anything like that
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Yeah, a Gangster was classy, a Mobster a little less so..
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true
true
i see what u mean
ok yea
but even still the point still stands
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and now a new generation is feveloping ...
6 years from now when the bells toll 12 on a certain Tuesday night, the British chavs will regroup...... they are unstoppable ... or are they?
*Cyber and his army of cyber clones slow mo walk towards us out of the misty darkness broken only by teh eyes of the infamous f00 pirate**Title screens play...*
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well i now have to ask, were gangsters ever good or is every ones view of them today skewed by Hollywood. it doesn't matter what reasons you broke the law for, it still doesn't change the fact that the law was broken and that its up to a jury of your peers to decide if you were justified in what you did or not.
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u dont understand it tec
they had a code that they ablige by
thy had respect for ppl
now days its aww im gonna piss on u
hollywood aint jack to me in this
im not being skewed in this
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u dont understand it tec
they had a code that they ablige by
thy had respect for ppl
now days its aww im gonna piss on u
hollywood aint jack to me in this
im not being skewed in this
that dose not change the fact that what they were doing was wrong and illegal
im of the belief that even if done with a reasonable level of respect breaking the law is still wrong
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ok mr law abliver
do u not jay walk
l9l
lol but ur right
but if ppl r gonna call them selfs gangsters then atleast have some class not be all out stupid and retarded with it
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1. No-one can present himself directly to another of our friends. There must be a third person to do it.
2. Never look at the wives of friends
3. Never be seen with cops.
4. Don't go to pubs and clubs.
5. Always being available for Cosa Nostra is a duty - even if your wife's about to give birth.
6. Appointments must absolutely be respected.
7. Wives must be treated with respect.
8. When asked for any information, the answer must be the truth.
9. Money cannot be appropriated if it belongs to others or to other families.
10. People who can't be part of Cosa Nostra: anyone who has a close relative in the police, anyone with a two-timing relative in the family, anyone who behaves badly and doesn't hold to moral values.
They were classy, Respected, and basically if you mess with them they mess with you. Unlike "gangsters" these days they just shoot and kill someone for no reason. Also "Cosa Nostra" means mafia just to clear that up
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that dose not change the fact that what they were doing was wrong and illegal
im of the belief that even if done with a reasonable level of respect breaking the law is still wrong
Laws by governemnts were initially set by aristocrats who didnt care for the common man, hence the rise of "gangstas" what would have started as more of a protest, got blown way out of proportion to what it is today.
Basically. laws should be taken more as guidlines =P
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see tehre ya go tec
and i also think he misses the sopranos
i know i do
ill give u a good post for that pie
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i have such a issue with people who believe that BS. you do realize that your talking about criminals. people who broke the law and killed and took advantage of others. it doesn't change the fact that what they did was wrong
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not every person branded as a criminal by the governemnt or court rooms murdered someone, not all "gangsters" killed, there are soo many differnet ways they could be given that name, im not sayign its right but some people arent as bad as you think.
Its this kind of mind set, that is whats wrong with the world today,
you need to know everyhting and noone even "criminials" should be branded as an entity.
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these people were not revolutionaries who were taking a stand against unjust laws to better humanity they ARE SCUM taking advantage of others to better them selves no amount of class changes that.
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To me the term "gangster" is more of an insult now.
I mean the original "gangsters" were smart men who just lived an impoverished life making them "tough".These good men made money exploiting the needs of the people, but not ruin the people they make money from.Case and point way back when, "Mafiosi" as the Italian mafia people were called didn't sell drugs. They became the government when there wasn't one.They were respected for what they did to help and also feared for what they can do.There were some like this like many of the Mexican gangs in L.A., they started out as block gangs protecting their neighborhood from dope dealers and other people who would hurt their neighborhood.
The new "gangsters" are typically men many of which are minorities and live on impoverished sections.Living in such a condition they found drugs. And some of these "smart" guys saw the profit and made their money through drug dealing.Many "gangsters" of today are just foot soldiers, if you think about it they ain't worth :censored: compared to guys back then (Unless you're a norteno ).
In short, gangsters back then( and some of recent like the men from Harlem ) was for sophisticated men who exploited in a way that doesn't hurt a lot of their business.Gangsters now are money and power hungry people that are disillusioned that the way to glory is through murder and dope dealing.They kill for fun,they don't (most) think about what they are doing and most aren't smart.
Discuss.
Don't move this to Spam section this is intelligent conversation.
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Laws by governemnts were initially set by aristocrats who didnt care for the common man, hence the rise of "gangstas" what would have started as more of a protest, got blown way out of proportion to what it is today.
Basically. laws should be taken more as guidlines =P
see i said the same, do you even read it all?
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i read it all but i was replying to tec
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i reread over what pie quoted and tahst what im talkin about
the itailan gangsters
if u wanna talk about killing ppl
go to george w bush
im done with this
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The "Gangsters" these days ruined the good name of Al Capone
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when will they learn pie ... /WHEN WILL THEY LEARN!!!
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no even back in the day of gangsters your talking about it was only about personal gain taking enough "protection money" to keep others form advancing any ware and injuring people and destroying businesses if people didn't pay. Killing and injuring any and all opposition i don't believe that these are the kind of people who should be admired or given any kind of recognition
The "Gangsters" these days ruined the good name of Al Capone
how the FU*K can you think that some one who was responsible for as much death and destruction as he was had a "good" name??
thats like saying Hitler had the right idea
you guys are making me sick you actually think that its ok to lie cheat steal and cause civil harm to better one's self and "family"
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no even back in the day of gangsters your talking about it was only about personal gain taking enough "protection money" to keep others form advancing any ware and injuring people and destroying businesses if people didn't pay. Killing and injuring any and all opposition i don't believe that these are the kind of people who should be admired or given any kind of recognition
how the FU*K can you think that some one who was responsible for as much death and destruction as he was had a "good" name??
thats like saying Hitler had the right idea
you guys are making me sick you actually think that its ok to lie cheat steal and cause civil harm to better one's self and "family"
Well he d id
and sorry al capone was a bad example
Also Buddhism That is all Thinking only about them selves. It's about not worrying for someone else and only your self. Personal Gain.
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Well he d id
and sorry al capone was a bad example
Also Buddhism That is all Thinking only about them selves. It's about not worrying for someone else and only your self. Personal Gain.
thats why they stand up against an oppressive communist government that has forces peaceful leaders form there home countries and violently crushed any opposition
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ok tec, you obviously only know how it is in the movie and game world, cos thats just lolworthy.....
apart form the infamous act of the holocaust, Hitler was a great leader, some of his ideologies were brilliant and really benefited his country, as after all thats what he was a leader,... he jsut went crazy and ruined it for himself,
We are not in this world to achieve everyones acceptance, we are here for ourselves and our familes, some poeple help other people and some people help themselves the wrong way, everyone s differenet, i mean peopel with different thoughts to yours believe they are just as correct as you, thats whats wrong with arguments, everyone has their own opinion so nothign will be resolved
"lie cheat and steal",, qouted from the late great eddie guerrero?
jeeeeez research before you post attack me ahite?
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ok tec, you obviously only know how it is in the movie and game world, cos thats just lolworthy.....
apart form the infamous act of the holocaust, Hitler was a great leader, some of his ideologies were brilliant and really benefited his country, as after all thats what he was a leader,... he jsut went crazy and ruined it for himself,
We are not in this world to achieve everyones acceptance, we are here for ourselves and our familes, some poeple help other people and some people help themselves the wrong way, everyone s differenet, i mean peopel with different thoughts to yours believe they are just as correct as you, thats whats wrong with arguments, everyone has their own opinion so nothign will be resolved
"lie cheat and steal",, qouted from the late great eddie guerrero?
jeeeeez research before you post attack me ahite?
I loved that Explanation, Thanks
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I loved that Explanation, Thanks
well i stand for what i believe and i will broadcast =P
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well i stand for what i believe and i will broadcast =P
What you said is totally true and i agree with you
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ok now that you understand hitler, youll understand cybers plot for world domination, only hell do it using technology, he started off just trying to benefit peopel who share interests but then he started to clone himself etc and hes bitten a bad apple, adam n eve style :winker:
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ok tec, you obviously only know how it is in the movie and game world, cos thats just lolworthy.....
apart form the infamous act of the holocaust, Hitler was a great leader, some of his ideologies were brilliant and really benefited his country, as after all thats what he was a leader,... he jsut went crazy and ruined it for himself,
We are not in this world to achieve everyones acceptance, we are here for ourselves and our familes, some poeple help other people and some people help themselves the wrong way, everyone s differenet, i mean peopel with different thoughts to yours believe they are just as correct as you, thats whats wrong with arguments, everyone has their own opinion so nothign will be resolved
"lie cheat and steal",, qouted from the late great eddie guerrero?
jeeeeez research before you post attack me ahite?
not a good enough reason to hate some one? his ability to form a functioning government dose not excuse the fact that what he did was wrong
im sorry that i think my life is unimportant in the big picture and that we were put hear to do something better than work for personal gain. obviously family is important but at what cost if the people you consider to be "gangsters" are allowed to do what they do
nope just a generalization of what all "gangsters" have done over time
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and back to the hitler thing
(no im not for him im not for killing the jews)
he revoltionised thsi world
if it wasnt for that war we wouldnt have alot of things
radar
jets
advances in automotive(the tanks helped with that)
the atomic bomb bad i know but = nuclear powerplants
better rockets = outer space exploration
the most tech advancements is during war
(this is so u cant say oh but its still bad)
the gangsters payed ppl off becuase other ppl did it to and it would hurt them and their family if they didnt counter offinceive
ehhh im stoped
i just had a brain fart my thos just scrammbled
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my whole argument has been "people must be held accountable for there actions, regardless of motivation" and i believe that people who commit crimes for personal gain are not the kinds of people who should be idolized
many good things have come out of bad and many bad things have come out of good.
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my whole argument has been "people must be held accountable for there actions, regardless of motivation" and i believe that people who commit crimes for personal gain are not the kinds of people who should be idolized
many good things have come out of bad and many bad things have come out of good.
Contradicting your entire argument, we are hwo we are and thats how it is,
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ok well who was a better LEADER? Hitler or Bush? The answer is Hitler.
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ok well who was a better LEADER? Hitler or Bush? The answer is Hitler.
Well in many ways they were the same, excepy instead of killng a race because he didnt like their ideas,'
Hes killing his own poeple and innocents.
And i think hats worse, we only think that hitler was worse cos of what we were told to think, Bush's methods are actuaslly worse we just dont see it as that
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Contradicting your entire argument, we are hwo we are and thats how it is,
thats dos not free you from your actions. you still need to be held accountable for what you do.
ok well who was a better LEADER? Hitler or Bush? The answer is Hitler.
what dose this have to to with "gangsters" and in my opinion bush because he did not attempt to create a "master race" he may have started a war that we will not be able to get out of because we live in a democratic society that is unable to make a decision and stick with it. but at least i can say it with out fear of violent reprisal from the government that I VOTED FOR.
Well in many ways they were the same, excepy instead of killng a race because he didnt like their ideas,'
Hes killing his own poeple and innocents.
And i think hats worse, we only think that hitler was worse cos of what we were told to think, Bush's methods are actuaslly worse we just dont see it as that
you dont know what your talking about. try doing some research instead of watching the news that has a political bias
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thats dos not free you from your actions. you still need to be held accountable for what you do.
what dose this have to to with "gangsters" and in my opinion bush because he did not attempt to create a "master race" he may have started a war that we will not be able to get out of because we live in a democratic society that is unable to make a decision and stick with it. but at least i can say it with out fear of violent reprisal from the government that I VOTED FOR.
you dont know what your talking about. try doing some research instead of watching the news that has a political bias
It was brought up so i argued my views on it also i am arguing that he was a better LEADER not the whole creating a master race. Hitler was a better LEADER.
And also lets not get fiesty this is just Arguing our views intelligently
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you dont know what your talking about. try doing some research instead of watching the news that has a political bias
Okay now youre just picking fights, for one thing i dont watch the news due to its politically bias views, Everythign i say jsut comes out as is, ask ken i tried to explain to him
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Okay now youre just picking fights, for one thing i dont watch the news due to its politically bias views, Everythign i say jsut comes out as is, ask ken i tried to explain to him
alright guys this was just arguing intelligently so please dont start fighting
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Ok lets clear things up here,First off Gangster is someone that is in a Gang.Selling drugs and killing people doesnt make you a gangster.It makes you a thug aka criminal.The italians werent gangsters,they were mobsters.Mobsters are groups of people that organize crime usually being relatives.I dont know when the term gangster changed from someone who is in a gang to someone that sells drugs and commits crimes.None of the famous italians mobsters where ever gangsters,Mafioso means your part of the Mafia.Thats what they were.The only Gangsters that may have ruined the word Gangster are people that go around creating there own gangs,or just go around claiming they're in a gang.
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Preach brother preach =P
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Ok lets clear things up here,First off Gangster is someone that is in a Gang.Selling drugs and killing people doesnt make you a gangster.It makes you a thug aka criminal.The italians werent gangsters,they were mobsters.Mobsters are groups of people that organize crime usually being relatives.I dont know when the term gangster changed from someone who is in a gang to someone that sells drugs and commits crimes.None of the famous italians mobsters where ever gangsters,Mafioso means your part of the Mafia.Thats what they were.The only Gangsters that may have ruined the word Gangster are people that go around creating there own gangs,or just go around claiming they're in a gang.
so true. but as we all should know, laws differ in different areas, like in amsterdam, marijuana is aloud, as is prostitution. this was done to reduce crime and better the society, if you havent noticed areas where more things are legal have lower crime rates than places with many laws, claiming that such things are not alowed. anyone can be a gangster and still abide the law, not the greatest example but the show scooby doo, they claimed to be a gang, and they BETTERED society. the way i view the mafia is that they were very intelegent people who were just trying to survive in their harsh surroundings, and not everyone that commits a crime is wrong in doing so, on technicality they are wrong for doing something in which they know shouldnt be done, but what about in societies like communist russia, they were alowed very little freedom, they werent alowed religion, which is a main thing because if you really want to look at it this way religion is quiet simmilare to gangs, a group of people trying to set values and guidelines in which others should live by. thats my two cents
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nicely put kammokaze
and syko
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i try XD but even though this is a debate lets not try to get too heated. and another thing, dont force stuff at other people, thats the one thing that irks me the most in when people force stuff on others. please dont.
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sorry to any i offended.
1. my main point was that irregardless of motivation breaking the law weather it be for good or bad is still breaking the law. and you must be held responsible for your actions.
2. in the contexts of the original question i do not believe that ether form of "gangster" should be glorified.
3.i am offended by the comparison of bush to hitler, because there is no comparison. and regardless of if i voted for him or not bush is still the president and my devotion to the president and the constitution would not change regardless of who the president was. if my views do differ i am offered the chance to vote, to run for office, and to do something about it. the Germans, polish, jews, gypsies, gays, and others were not given that chance. there is NO comparison.
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1. my main point was that irregardless of motivation breaking the law weather it be for good or bad is still breaking the law. and you must be held responsible for your actions.
what if some one killed every one that u loved and there was no way for th courts to come to the conclusion that the man that u APSOLUTLY KNEW killed them all.
but u where for certain about it
what would u do
would u make him pay for it or would u sity there and say
nothing i can do and just walk on?
he showed u the proff and took it away and u couldnt find it and neither could the cops
and ur not offending anyone
some ppl cant take an argument like an argument with out it becoming personal
i dont know why
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what if some one killed every one that u loved and there was no way for th courts to come to the conclusion that the man that u APSOLUTLY KNEW killed them all.
but u where for certain about it
what would u do
would u make him pay for it or would u sity there and say
nothing i can do and just walk on?
he showed u the proff and took it away and u couldnt find it and neither could the cops
and ur not offending anyone
some ppl cant take an argument like an argument with out it becoming personal
i dont know why
oh for sure i would make the bastard pay, but i do so knowing that i will be held responsible for my actions. weather it be by the law or what ever maker i believe in. but my knowing in no way justifies the action i would take. nor dose it excuse me from the consequences.
and i do understand why people take offense. any time you touch on peoples beliefs things get heated.
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Also Buddhism That is all Thinking only about them selves. It's about not worrying for someone else and only your self. Personal Gain.
Ummm... I think that you need to re-evaluate your understanding of buddhism, it's about personal enlightenment, and making the world a better place for yourself and others by attaining enlightenment... yes, the end result is a personal gain, but that is the same basic reward system that all religions are based on...
this whole discussion is kinda sad and really shows the lack of comprehension and understanding that people have now in regards to certain sociological issues...
mafiosi were not the people that movies have made them out to be, they exploited the people in their communities for personal gain and gave those people false hopes, killed innocents, and destroyed the lives and livelyhood of defiants they did not kill. they were criminals simply by associating themselves with the mafia, organized crime is still crime...
what if some one killed every one that u loved and there was no way for th courts to come to the conclusion that the man that u APSOLUTLY KNEW killed them all.
but u where for certain about it
what would u do
would u make him pay for it or would u sity there and say
nothing i can do and just walk on?
he showed u the proff and took it away and u couldnt find it and neither could the cops
and ur not offending anyone
some ppl cant take an argument like an argument with out it becoming personal
i dont know why
whether you know absolutely or not it's still a crime if you take matters into your own hands outside of the justice system. crime is independent of motivation and personal beliefs, it's conviction that is dependent on motivation, mental state, and personal beliefs... and a group of your peers...
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dead on doc that is why i do not believe that "gangsters" should be glorified in any way
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don't get me wrong, I'm a huge "Godfather" fan, one of my favorite movies, but I know it was a movie, it was fictional... the mob isn't really like that, I know, they burned my great-grandfather's market when he told them he wouldn't pay them to protect him from nothing... the only people the mob are 'protecting' you from is themselves...
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Buddhism is about personal gain
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Buddhism is about personal gain
ok so then if it is about personal gain, then how does that make it any different than any other religion?
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ok so then if it is about personal gain, then how does that make it any different than any other religion?
Christianity is about helping others and bringing them to faith
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Christianity is about helping others and bringing them to faith
no if you believe the first counsel of Jerusalem its about belief in jesus.
but lets not break in to religion, as this has gone so far off topic and this will only get more heated as were straying in to territory that people build there life on.
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yeah i think its a good idea to stay off of religion too heated. but 'gangsters' ( the '' are to symbolize mafia gangsters) were people who found a way to survive, it was wrong, based on my morals, although some may see it differently. basically what im saying is that right and wrong are based on 2 factors, the justice system, and personal beliefs. the 'gangsters' were morally right but justifiably wrong. and no mean to get on your bad side or anything tec, but not everyone on here lives in america, so not everyone knows how things work over here. some people have no choice in the matter, like in the times of slavery in america, people were based guilty or not just from their skin tone, so based on laws laid out for the majority isnt exactly a very good way to tell if someone is right or wrong.
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Christianity is about helping others and bringing them to faith
that comment is quite naive, but I digress, you guys are right, this is not the best place for religious debate...
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yeah i think its a good idea to stay off of religion too heated. but 'gangsters' ( the '' are to symbolize mafia gangsters) were people who found a way to survive, it was wrong, based on my morals, although some may see it differently. basically what im saying is that right and wrong are based on 2 factors, the justice system, and personal beliefs. the 'gangsters' were morally right but justifiably wrong. and no mean to get on your bad side or anything tec, but not everyone on here lives in america, so not everyone knows how things work over here. some people have no choice in the matter, like in the times of slavery in america, people were based guilty or not just from their skin tone, so based on laws laid out for the majority isnt exactly a very good way to tell if someone is right or wrong.
i would love to know how you justify number running, racketeering, and election rigging as morally right.
and i realize that not every one on hear is from the US, and i have a little problem with people who are not US citizens bashinging the US government. i realize you have every right to do so, but that doesn't mean its not going to set me off.
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what im trying to say is people have different morals. what you might find wrong someone else might find to be right. like racial/religios jokes, I find them acceptable within reason, you might not. different morals. i dont find the acts that you recalled morally justified. but they may have. man this is tough on a psp. but thats my views.
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i get what your saying but that still dose not excuse the act. even if you dont have a problem committing a crime that dosnt make it any less a crime
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i never said that it didnt, and im not saying that your putting words in my mouth, but your right, it is still wrong based on the law of the land. what i was getting at was it is morally right to them