Xbox One trigger woes

[Immortal]

Hi all.

Think I may have nuked my triggers, purchased a stripped xbox one pcb from focusattack and went to work building my first custom joystick. Got every button working and registering fine except for the life of my I cant get the triggers to work.


This is my left trigger http://oi57.tinypic.com/r9fsdl.jpg the bottom left contact finally just melted off, however before that stage I tried everything including with putting a 100ohm resistor in, tried connecting it to just the top pin under U11 as some said, no matter where I put it though it wont register for me in game.

http://oi58.tinypic.com/2vblama.jpg this is the right trigger, it -was- working fine with just a 1w 100ohm resistor so I glued the wire in place, however now for some reason it doesnt want to pick up at all, not sure if ive maybe killed something on the other side with the triggers. I have rechecked the ground/switch etc for the button all seems good.

This is only my first time soldering I know the right trigger is rough however it worked. I can solder alot better and more precise since I had no problem wiring up the left trigger just could never get it to register.

Have I destroyed the triggers on this pcb? only thing I can think of is maybe the resistor is too much at 1 watt? I live in australia and only shop I know that sells stuff like this I could only find a 1watt 100ohm however think they may have 1/2 watt if that would make any difference?

Im at a loss with these triggers and starting to give up, please help!

Update: the trace still works, if I go into a game and controller options I can press the wire roughly along where its supposed to sit and it will trigger the button ok, however anytime I try solder it on the connection wont register im assuming as ive removed the metal connector/solder that was on the pcb.

Is there anywhere else abit easier I can solder the wire to, or can I fix the bit I removed somehow? this is my first time playing around with electronics so im abit lost.

Thanks for any help
Modify message[gmod]please use the modify tab to update your thread so u do not double post in the future thanks![/gmod]

[RDC]

You do not bridge anything for the Triggers, wherever you heard that was incorrect and if you assumed it, then sorry, but you do not know what you are doing. Bridging any connections causes a short, which 99.9% of the time will only cause problems.

On your RT, it looks like the thing is shorting on the ground plane of the RF board, as you have the wire stripped back far enough to jump rope with it. If that's not the problem with it, then clean all of that off of there, as there is no way at all to tell what's under that mountain of solder and then assess the damage and start over.

For the LT, you've managed to tear up both lower pads there for C38 and R42, so that's wide open and will not work for now. What you need to do there is remove the black bumper pad from the PCB first. Then follow from where the pads used to be and trace down and prep the Via it goes to, the one that's almost between the LSX and AN+ pads for the LS, then use it as the connection to reinstall the 100ohm Resistor back in place. It will go from that Via to the top/right connection of U11 in your pic.

From what I've seen there so far, and this has been my experience more often than not, if you're the one that managed to get it into that shape, then you're most likely not going to be the one to straighten it all out and get it working again as the repair work is always more difficult than what the original work was. So take far more time and planning into account, some practice on some scrap board wouldn't hurt either, as prepping a Via has to be done correctly or you'll just make the hole you're already in deeper and wider. If you can get some 30awg wire that would be preferable to what you're using now also.

[Immortal]

Your right I dont know what im doing, but im only trying to learn. Unfortunately I dont have anyone in my life that can teach me so I just have to learn the hard way, if I knew anyone or even a shop I wouldnt be asking for help trust me.  I did a little practice first then by bad choice started on the trigger should have left it till last.

I probably dont have the term right, but this is basically what I was trying to do http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2uhoaza&s=5#.VX9NRvmqpBc "bridge" the RC filter was what someone said in a video, to a 100ohm resistor then to the button which was actually working ok but considering how sloppy it was I removed it and will start again to prevent problems in the future.

So looking at this trace http://s50.photobucket.com/user/RDCXBG/media/XB1/1537BBB_zps5a82a56d.jpg.html theres 2 via's near the x on the right hand side? sorry but you might have to be more specific as I know nothing of circuits. So do I solder one end of the 100ohm direct into the via, run a wire from the other end of the resistor to the top right pin of U11, or run a wire from the via to U11 with the resistor in the middle? i'll have to try look up videos on how to solder to a via now once thats done however how do I hook up the button? or (just taking a stab in the dark again here obviously) do I wire from the via, to U11, to a resistor then to the button?

Thanks for your advice RDC

[RDC]

Everyone has to start somewhere, it's just better (for the PCB and you) to start off on something a bit easier. If you can't find out how to do something with Google, then I'll guarantee that you can find 100 people doing it the wrong way and then learn from their mistakes.

Bridge isn't the correct term to use there, as that means to connect two spots that are normally not connected, like what a bridge for a vehicle or train does. What they have done in that pic there is attach the wire to two spots that are already connected on the board, so either one could have been used and it would have worked the exact same, it's just a shade easier to solder to both at once is all, but nothing is getting bridged there.

Your RT should be alright, though the pic wasn't as good as it could be, but I didn't see any real damage there aside from the wire being stripped back too far where it could have been shorting on something.

For the LT, the Via marked with the Blue X there is the LSX Via, and just to the left of that is one that is Blue with a Red dot Via, that is the LT Via you'll want to prep and use.

Read thru this thread (plenty of pics to look at also, but remember they're only worth 1000 words, it's the few that aren't included in the pic that are the important ones) it's 9 years old now, but info is still relevant.

http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?/topic/512248-broken-trace/#entry3406983

You'll want to solder the 100ohm Resistor from the Via to the top/right spot of U11. That will restore the controller to a more or less normally working state as it is replacing R42 that you have torn off there, provided nothing else has been messed up that is. You're better off soldering a wire to the Via also and then to the Resistor. Don't solder the leads of the Resistor directly to the Via, or to anything on the PCB really, as the lead is a more solid piece of wire and if care is not taken you can cause more damage to the Via if it's pulled on or moved as it will exert far more force on the solder joint than a small wire that's soldered in place correctly and then glued down, back from the solder joint like you have done with the RT wire, that is the proper way of doing that.

Then you'll solder you're new LT button to the same LT via. The other side of the button can go to the Resistor (only needs to be 10ohm or so) and then to Ground. It does not make one drop of spit which side of the button the Resistor goes on. The LT side, or the Ground side, it doesn't make a bit of difference, it's all the same for doing that.

[Immortal]

So essentially seeing as I melted the contact I need to create a new trace to tap into for my button circuit? just out of curiosity how come it needs a connection from the via to U11 and not just straight from U11 to the button like ive seen someone have a picture of it hooked up. Or did they maybe scrape back abit of the trace to expose the connection and solder to that also?

I only have 1w 25ohm and 100ohm resistors here is it ok to use the 25ohm for LT? I originally had a 25ohm resistor on RT (by mistake) and it didnt work until I swapped it over for a 100 ohm.

If it fails i've got one more board here I can start again on. Thing that sucks is being from Australia I dont think I can buy a stripped xbox one pcb here I had 2 buy these 2 from the US, so if I cant get this going i'll have to either order another (and wait, again) or pay $70 for a local controller and try strip it back myself. My stepson wants one for his xbox one and I was hoping to build one for the pc

Thanks for your advice once again. Ive always wanted to learn to solder probably not the best project to start on but oh well, its all good. Might have to pick up a book from my local Jaycar when I get some free time next and actually learn some stuff.

[RDC]

The reason you need to put the 100ohm Resistor back in there is to restore how the Trigger originally worked, then you can go about duplicating it. I'm not going to get into alternate methods of repair or how to fudge it so it will just work as you're having enough time with this as is.

A 25ohm is fine for the duplicate button LT/RT Resistor, and really only 1 of them is even needed for both Triggers.

Ground goes to one side of the 25ohm Resistor.
The other side of the 25ohm Resistor goes to one side each of your duplicate LT and RT buttons.
The other side of the duplicate LT button goes to LT line.
The other side of the duplicate RT button goes to RT line.
Done, your 2 buttons are now LT and RT.

Code: [Select]


       (25ohm)  /-----NEW_LT_BUTTON-----LT_OF_CONTROLLER
GND----/\/\/\---
                \-----NEW_RT_BUTTON-----RT_OF_CONTROLLER


[Immortal]

Got LT working thanks to your method with the via and U11, seems to register perfect under windows controller settings testing the axis.

However now since removing my hideous RT joint I cant seem to get it to register anything. Just pressing the wire (with the button down) on the pin on U10, or the join where I originally had it soldered to, even the via it runs to doesnt seem to give it any sort of response. Which is kinda odd to me as all I did was remove the old wire really quickly.

I thought I may have destroyed the trace again but maybe the sender has stopped working as touching the wires to any of the pins of it doesnt do anything anymore.

http://oi59.tinypic.com/2h6edfk.jpg

Any ideas? maybe its just time to give up on this one and live with 7 buttons for me, will just have to cross my fingers I get both triggers working on my step sons or he probably wont have much use for it.

[RDC]

Don't go poking wires around on other leads of any component if you have no idea what they are for. One of them is Ground, so it would have done nothing anyway, but the other is power and you could have killed the power source for both Triggers or fragged that Hall sensor.

Remove that wire from the RT spot, clean all of that up wit a Q-tip and some rubbing alcohol and try to get a better pic. If you have a DMM (Digital Multi-Meter) then you can check everything out, if not, you may want to invest in one.

[Immortal]

Bought a basic multimeter.



No idea what setting is best for reading, or what anything should actually be reading, but to try save some time I went to this one, connected the ground and tested both triggers.

LT that is working fine came up 0.35 on the setting on the pic, RT that I have just soldered to the bottom right pin of U10 came up also with 0.35 on the wire/switch etc, both reading the same however only LT works, guessing that means at least RT hall sensor still works?

The bottom left contact of R39 RC filter (for RT) came off though so im assuming the trace wont work again? however I cant seem to find where the via is for RT to do the same method I did on LT.

Updated:Went back and had a better look at the trace and found the via for RT, hooked up to that and U10 to the switch and now, FINALLY, have both triggers working. What a mission.

Thanks for all your help RDC, know im terrible but without you wouldnt have got the triggers working and probably would have ended up just tossing the lot in the bin.

If you wouldnt mind giving me a little info on using the multi though would be great  [gmod]stop double posting, use your modify tab to update your thread![/gmod]

[RDC]

You have the meter on the Amp setting, that's one that you'll rarely use.

The two you'll be using most ofter are Voltage (V symbol) and Resistance (Omega symbol) then the Diode checker could come in handy as well, --|>--

Since that's not an auto ranging meter, when you do any voltage or Resistance checks always start off on a higher setting than what you're testing.

For any voltages inside the X1 controller there, you'd only need it set to the 20 setting, for 20volts. Then for Resistance it depends on the value you're testing as to where you'd set that, but for example you're 100ohm Resistors you'd set that to the 200 setting, for 200ohms, and never have any power in the circuit when testing Resistance.

Every meter is a little bit different, but they all end up doing the same basic things in roughly the same way, just be sure to go over the manual a few times to see if anything special needs done when checking anything, and always be extra careful if you're ever going to be poking around in anything that has main voltage (wall outlet) power in it. Also be careful with the test leads when probing around, as you can cause shorts or slip off of your test spot and damage the PCB severing traces or knocking off components.

[Immortal]

Cheers for the tips RDC. Have learnt a little just from this thread alone.

Got my first pcb with all buttons working but for some reason on the second pcb I bought I cant get a thing to register from the triggers, either with the wires connected up or with the multimeter, so not sure whats going on there but I least have one controller my stepson can use on his xbone I might just order a ps360 for my pc stick, only downside wont be able to slay him on MKX on his console but its all good.

Thanks for your patience and tips throughout.

[RDC]

Welcome.

Unless the other controller is different there shouldn't be any issues with the Triggers. Do they work with the magnets on the Triggers like they are supposed to?

Do you mean a Perfect 360 stick? If so that 'requires' a 5v source to work correctly, which the XB1 controller does not have and you would not want anyway as the thing would then have 5v on the UDLR outputs and the button lines are all 3.3v in the XB1 controller, but it should be fine powering it on the 3.3v from the XB1. Worst case there you can mod the thing and swap out some Resistors and/or the Logic chip to get it going. I did that many, many moons ago on a project that used the Wired CL controller, so I had lower voltage and Inverting that needed done, but it should work fine straight off in your installation.

[Immortal]

I bought both pcb's as bare/already stripped pcbs from the U.S, a local controller here is $70/80 then would have to take it apart etc figured would just be easier.

Ive already spent far too long on these controllers, just ordered a ps360+ for myself so I can just have 2 working sticks, the supplier here in aus seems to think the 360+ works with xbox one but anything ive read online says it doesnt, unless they've had a recent update and somehow work. Either way even if it only works on the pc i'll be content.

When I say "perfect" i just mean all buttons working I could put this second stick together without triggers but I need every button for MK which we both want to play and im tired of looking at it.

[RDC]

According to the current specs of that, it works with the XBOX, the first one, not the XBOX ONE, latest one.

http://www.focusattack.com/akishop-ps360-multi-console-joystick-pcb/

You can make it work on the XB1 with the CronusMAX though, and at some point it could be made to work as it's firmware upgradable, but at present it doesn't seem to.