DualSense 5 Controller PCB Scans

[RDC]

DualSense 5, BDM-010, 6-layer PCB, yep. So far the only real hardware differences among these has been the color of the FPC (Blue or Green) and there are a couple of different TouchPads, but I haven't looked into the other version yet.

BDM-010 MOTHERBOARD TOP


BDM-010 MOTHERBOARD BOTTOM


NOTE: Most all buttons now are common ground, with the exception of L2 and R2 which are a more standard type voltage divider setup now, and then L3 and R3 which are active Hi buttons and if duplicating them is desired then wire directly up to the solder joints for them.

VIAS FOR BUTTONS









The L1/L2 and R1/R2 Trigger assemblies are pretty much identical, from a hardware standpoint, so the TP spots on them are the same.

NOTE: If duplicating the L2/R2 consider doing that thru a 1k Resistor versus driving the L2/R2 line directly to ground.

TRIGGER ASSEMBLY FFC CONNECTOR PINOUTS - CAUTION: These are the BDM-010 pinouts and the Left side and the Right side connectors are placed 180 from each other, thus their pinouts are reversed. Thank Sony for it, as it's not the first, nor I'm sure last, time they've done this.

LEFT SIDE FFC PINOUT

1 - GND
2 - M+/-
3 - M-/+
4 - GND
5 - 1.8vE
6 - WP2
7 - SCL2
8 - SDA2
9 - L1
10 - GND
11 - 1.8v
12 - GND
13 - L2
14 - GND
15 - L2 Feedback
16 - 1.8v

RIGHT SIDE FFC PINOUT

1 - 1.8v
2 - R2 Feedback
3 - GND
4 - R2
5 - GND
6 - 1.8v
7 - GND
8 - R1
9 - SDA1
10 - SCL1
11 - WP1
12 - 1.8vE
13 - GND
14 - M-/+
15 - M+/-
16 - GND

THINGS TO NOTE:

The Trigger assemblies have EEPROMS on them. Why? I have no clue. Might just be to identify them to the motherboard or have some kind of calibration data on them for the feedback feature or might have Hoffa's resting place stored in hex backwards, so you've been warned that removing the boards may or may not cause some kind of unwanted side effects. I have no PS5 here to play around on seeing what those things do if they are swapped, messed with or missing. My current opinion would be to leave them installed, as they take up jack for room once they are removed from the assembly and you then have nice TP spots to solder things to versus tiny harder spots on the motherboard and who knows what kinds of possible issues removing them might cause.
 
The SDA, SCL and WP lines are for those EEPROM and should be left alone.

The L1 and R1 are active Lo buttons.

The L2 and R2 are Analog, but still technically active Lo and if the Trigger assembly is removed, a Pull-Up Resistor needs to be installed from L2/R2 to 1.8v, then your new button should go from L2/R2 to Ground thru a 1k Resistor.

The L2/R2 Feedback lines are how the controller knows what position the Force Feedback motor is at. This probably should have something done with it so those lines are not floating, but again, no PS5 here so no idea what the best course of action to take on those currently is, so again, safer to leave the boards intact for now.


BWL-010, TRIGGER ASSEMBLY TOP


BWL-010, TRIGGER ASSEMBLY BOTTOM


BWL-010 FFC PINOUT - CAUTION: This is the pinout of the FFC connector on the BWL-010 board above, it is NOT the pinout of the FFC connector on the motherboard. See above for those.

1 - 1.8v
2 - L2/R2 Feedback
3 - GND
4 - L2/R2
5 - GND
6 - 1.8v
7 - GND
8 - L1/R1
9 - SDA1
10 - SCL1
11 - WP1
12 - 1.8vE
13 - GND
14 - M-
15 - M+
16 - GND

TOUCHPAD, LT-01 TOP


TOUCHPAD, LT-01 BOTTOM



The second revision of the DS5. Nothing really special to note just yet, as I've only started looking into this one. It's a 4 layer now instead of 6. The Vias for all of the main face buttons, PS, X, O, /\, [ ], DR, DU, DL, DD are in the same location and order as the BDM-010.

BDM-020 MOTHERBOARD TOP


BDM-020 MOTHERBOARD BOTTOM



The L1/L2 and R1/R2 Trigger assemblies are pretty much identical, from a hardware standpoint, but the TP spots have been moved around on this version.

NOTE: If duplicating the L2/R2 consider doing that thru a 1k Resistor versus driving the L2/R2 line directly to ground.

BWL-020, TRIGGER ASSEMBLY TOP


BWL-020, TRIGGER ASSEMBLY BOTTOM



Third revision of the DS5. Few changes this time around, more on all that later. 

BDM-030 MOTHERBOARD TOP


BDM-030 MOTHERBOARD BOTTOM


The Trigger assemblies are not as complex anymore. The PCB just has the Feedback POT on it, with the motor being wired directly to the motherboard like the Rumble motors are.

The FPC is also changed and now has the L1, L2, R1 and R2 buttons incorporated into it, bringing it back inline with how the DS4, DS3 and even the DS2 were made.

BDM-030 FPC TOP



Fourth revision of the DS5.

BDM-040 MOTHERBOARD TOP


BDM-040 MOTHERBOARD BOTTOM

[LethalPrime]

I wouldnt say consider duplicating the R2 L2 with a 1k resistor, but to actually do it. Since its at 4.9k  when not pressed vs 1.9k when fully pressed so to always make it do 100% press for FPS youd need it to complete at 1.9k

The VR carbon strips are modular and not on the trigger board. So it would be better to add your own resistor since were not sandwiching an SFX for the triggers.

Btw, You didnt watermark your scans RDC

[RDC]

Didn't say with, said thru.

L2 - 1k - Tact - GND, or L2 - Tact - 1k - GND

The L2/R2 is also closer to ~5.6k not pulled, being the PU is around 7.8k and the voltage at the divider is ~0.75v not pulled, then ~0.35v for a full pull, so a 1k will get you ~0.2v when the new Tact is pressed, shade more than a full pull.

If the FPC is going to be removed, then an 8k Resistor needs to be installed from the L2/R2 spot to either of the 1.8v spots, and a 5.6k from the L2/R2 to GND so the divider stays intact, or a 10k/7.5k setup, and a 1k should still be used on the new Tact.

Yeah, I know who made them though.

[LethalPrime]

Yep, Im kinda glad they went with what they did because it also means that FPC can be replaced with your own that has the buttons and resistors built in. Theoretically you could just swap one in. Lets face it the adaptive triggers are a gimmick even Microsoft didnt bother to update, cross compatibility aside a rumble under there was just fine

The Dualsense is largely a Microsoft patent workaround imo (including anti friction rings) lol

[MCorgano]

  just put of curiosity could we also get scans of the button ribbons? It's so nice having scans of the PCBs it'd be nice to have high quality scans of the ribbons as well

[MCorgano]

Actually it would be much more useful to have a pinout of the trigger module. I'm thinking if mod kits were going to be made then this would be the most useful place to tap into the triggers. An arrangement similar to the JDM-030 could be made, with two branches that go to each trigger and replace their cables, a central double sided connection for the offset connector they use for the face buttons, and the mod chip somewhere in the middle (or off to the side of the trigger modules, there is TONNES of room on the outside)

[RDC]

A complicated and expensive FPC design or solder 4 wires to easy TP spots on the modules for the L1, L2, R1 and R2 connections. Tough call.

[MCorgano]

Ok fair enough. I was thinking more in terms of making plug and play kits for people without soldering experience.

I wonder if at some point they might remove the test points? God knows they did enough revisions of the ds4 it makes me wonder what they'll change in future ds5 revisions.

[MCorgano]

Question, on the scan of the touchpad underside, there are rectangles along the bottom edge. What are those? What are they for? If they're LED's, I haven't seen any software that uses them yet.

[LethalPrime]

Cool it with the double posts guy, theres an edit button for a reason, sometimes I feel like you just say things to boost your posting score and nothing more.

Theyre player indicator lights just like on PS4

[MCorgano]

WAit the ps4 didn't have player indicator lights? I thought it used the lightbar for that. Or have I been missing something the whole time?

[RDC]

The DS4 only has the light bar with a single RGB LED.

The DS5 has a single RGB LED on the motherboard for creating the light around the Touchpad. Then there are 5 White LEDs in the Touchpad that could be used for any number of things that light up the 'bar' between the Touchpad and the Sticks. Then the Mic Mute button has it's own LED for lighting that thing up when it's muted or for anything else they would want to flash or pulse it for.

[MCorgano]

Actually I was wondering about the RGB LED on the dualsense. There appear to be three.... I assume mosfets? on the lines to the RGB led. I want have one of these and want to wire them to match the RGB led
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001564054055.html
I'm wondering if i just wire it to the same line if it will damage the controller, or if it will just make all led's run dimmer. If I can't directly wire the extra led's to it, how could I drive it from the same lines that the stock LED uses?

Also the little controller board (that I sadly can't take a picture of because my phone camera died) has what appears to be three mosfets on it, and I'm wondering if i could just wire the pre-mosfet data lines from the controller R-G-B to the pre-mosfet positions on the driver board (and remove the little programmed chip from it.)

At the very least, do you know what component those mosfets are? That would be a starting point to finding out how they're driven / what they can do.

[RDC]

The DS5 has a dedicated 4.15v rail that powers all of the LEDs in it, though I'm not sure I go tossing 72 more LEDs on that rail as who knows what it's designed to actually source.

Those 3 components on the DS5 around the RGB are N channel FETs, they turn the Ground side of each of the the R, G, or B on/off, same as how the control board for that pile of LEDs works.

Letting that smaller LED control board and it's FETs or Transistors be the 'go between' and have it wired to straight battery power would be the way to drive those, as they already have it setup that way. Then you'll just be using the DS5 RGB control signals to turn on those LED control board FETs also.

Pin 1 of each of those FETs on the DS5 are the control lines.

[MCorgano]

You are like the holy grail of useful information. Any idea which one of the fets are R/G/B? Already got the mystery chip off the led driver board and wires soldered to it.

Edit: The bottom / left one is Red, trying to figure out which one is green or blue.

[RDC]

The one by itself is for Red. The other two, the top one is for Blue, bottom one, probably for Green.

[MCorgano]

I gave it a try, and thr pins of the LED from left to right are +, G, B, R. I found this out by getting red and blue backwards

I burned out some of the LED's on the button ribbon, so I'm thinking I should replace some resistors to lower the current a bit. The stock driver board has 2.2K resistors before the mosfets, and 20 ohm resistors for red / green and 10 ohm for blue between the mosfets and the led string. IS it more proper to replace the resistors before or after the mosfets? If I increase them should I keep the difference the same (ex change 20 / 10 ohm for 50 / 40 ohm) or should I maintain the ratio? (ex 50 / 25 ohm)

Sorry for all the questions. I link to tinker and I have some idea what i'm doing but I'm no electrical engineer.

[RDC]

The 2.2k before the FETs are likely going to the Gates of them, changing them will do nothing, but they need to be there to keep from burning the FETs up. The ones after the FETs will be the ones that need changed to limit the current to the LEDs. Without having a clue what the LED voltage drop is or how many you're dealing with, I'd just toss a POT in there and adjust it until it's where you want, then remove it and measure the value and the closest higher value Resistor is what you'd want.

Also need to be aware that thing is designed to be connected to the battery directly, and there is jack all for regulation there, so that voltage will be 4.2v max while it's charging and should be setup to be able to handle that. Then it's going to drop over time to ~3v at the lowest, so the LEDs will not be driven with a constant voltage.

[MCorgano]

OH Ok, that makes a lot of sense. I have little constant current regulator modules that are designed to power LED's from a liion battery. I could put one of those in series, turn it down a bit, and then that should make the brightness output of the secondary LED's more consistent as the battery drains right? It's one of these
http://www.canton-electronics.com/power-converter-modules-c-4/driver-power-c-4_169/dc-36v-00315a-led-driver-constant-current-adjustable-module-pwm-control-board-for-arduino-uno-mega2560-breadboard-pic-arm-p-1058.html

Another thought, are there any power rails on the controller i could tap into that are more appropriate to wire the led's into rather than directly to the battery?

Edit: I put the little regulator module in line with the power for the led driver mosfet board, and it worked as expected. I cam dim the LED's more It also has a chip enable line, so I can even use it as a switch. I'll probably tie it to one fo the 3v3 rails so it theoretically doesn't use any power when the controller is off.

Edit2: Ok so I got to the point where the led was flickering different colors, so I think I might have a partial short or something. Then my controller shut off. I think I'll wait for someone else to figure this out before I accidently my controller, or wait for me to get a controller that has a broken shell so I don't care if I accidently it permenantly..

Now I'm looking for just a better driver chip. The modules that come with these led's are kinda dumb. I know you can get 5v RGB LED drivers ment for led strips, that support a range of patterns and whatnaught. I'm trying to find something similar for 3v leds.

[MCorgano]

Sorry for the double post but this post is completely irrelevant to the previous 5 and instead a direct reply to the one quoted.

Didn't say with, said thru.

L2 - 1k - Tact - GND, or L2 - Tact - 1k - GND

The L2/R2 is also closer to ~5.6k not pulled, being the PU is around 7.8k and the voltage at the divider is ~0.75v not pulled, then ~0.35v for a full pull, so a 1k will get you ~0.2v when the new Tact is pressed, shade more than a full pull.

If the FPC is going to be removed, then an 8k Resistor needs to be installed from the L2/R2 spot to either of the 1.8v spots, and a 5.6k from the L2/R2 to GND so the divider stays intact, or a 10k/7.5k setup, and a 1k should still be used on the new Tact.

Yeah, I know who made them though.

I recently discovered that the pot for the adaptive triggers runs through the button ribbon, so if you replace / augment the button ribbon the person MUST consider how that affects the resistance between the pot and... ground? +? I'm not engineer. I took it apart previously and despite writing directions for other people how to put it back together correctly aligned one of the gears wrong. While working on it i was testing it and it was centering at the wrong position - weird - so I plugged back in the button ribbon and everything started working correctly. This means that if somehow the button ribbon gets damaged it could also mess up the adaptive triggers.

Oh and as for how i tested the triggers, DS4Windows recently added some options for them in an update, like simulated hair triggers and such.

[RDC]

The Feedback POT for the Adaptive Triggers goes to TP5, then to the connector that goes to the motherboard, so the only ribbon that it runs thru is the FPC cable that connects the Trigger Assembly to the motherboard.

[MCorgano]

Ok interesting. Using ds4windows "ridgid" trigger setting, i could unplug and plug in the trigger button ribbon (that goes under the trigger / shoulder buttons) and upon unplugging it, the force feedback plunger position would change. upon plugging it back in, it would return to the expected position. Any idea what causes this?

On the LED front, I ordered one of these https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32978033331.htm
My thinking is even if it says the lowest is 5v, it might just work on 3v. After receiving it I'm happy to say it does! After removing the connector and adding 20ohm resistors on the green blue and 10ohm resistors on the red line, it works a treat. Much nicer to work with than the stock module and has a remote. The last thing to consider is turning it on and off - it doesn't have an enable pin as far as I can find. Either I'm looking at getting a second module that has some kind fo enable pin, rigging up a mosfet or something to turn it on and off (I have a bunch of random n channel mosfets I ordered forever ago, not sure how to use them. YOLO)

Are there any power rail test points I can tap into to use as an enable? Something that's only on when the controller turns on?

EDIT: I metered my entire led circuit i plan to drive, controller included, and it peaked to about 160ma. Is there any 3.3-4.2v rail that is only powered when the controller is on, that would be safe to just wire the thing in directly? OR is wiring it to the battery still recommended?

[RDC]

Unplugging the small FPC wrecks the voltage divider that makes up the L2/R2 since they are Analog. I can only guess they do not have direct access to the Feedback signal and are just using the L2/R2 position for now to show where that is. Wire up a Tact straight across the L2 or R2 contacts, press it, and see if the Feedback signal goes to 100%. If it does, then that's not the actual Feedback signal as the Tact will not move that Feedback POT at all.

The remote has on/off buttons. Use the AN+ of the Sticks for an Enable signal. It's a switched 1.8v source that will be good enough for turning on/off an N channel FET.

I have no way of knowing what a safe current to pull from any of the spots in there would be as I didn't design it or have access to the DataSheet for the PMIC in there.

[MCorgano]

Through some experimenting I can tell it's definitely using the pot position to close the loop for the stepper position. I think now that it was the software side doing it - it was scaling the FFB position to how hard the trigger was pressed. That would explain the lack of direct electrical connection affecting the position and why the position changes when you unplug the cable - because the position of the trigger does.

[MCorgano]

Kind of tangentially related. what model of sticks do the new dualsense controllers use? Are they still 10K pots on the analog sticks or has that changed?

[wickated]

all same

[MCorgano]

Oh ok, I also heard somewhere there was a new revision of ps5 controller labeled BDM-020. Anything notably different on the new version?

[RDC]

Haven't had one to really dig into yet, but they put the MCU on the other side of the board.

[synrg]

Hello Guys,

i'm sitting in a wheelchair and want to build me a adaptive controller, like the XBOX adaptive controller.
But i can't find any informations about the solder points for the create and options buttons on the pcb.
Do you know where are these solder points? Are there also solder points for the touchpad button
on the main pcb. I hope you can help me.

Best regards
synrg

[RDC]

There aren't any nice easy to hit solder points for the Create and Option buttons, unless you were to remove them, then you could use the existing solder pads for the buttons. The TP button is on the TP board, and there is a spot to solder to for it, if it's take apart first. The first post has been update with the vias for all of those buttons. Do take care when soldering to those vias, as you pretty much get just one shot at them before it becomes much more difficult to get to the next usable spots.